Putting out Fires
Editorial · Foreign Policy · War
submitted by CindyS on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 9:37am PST
Putting out Fires
Day 10
The Peaceful Occupation of Iraq

The right wingers are really having a field day with me. It hurts me really badly, but I am willing to put up with the crap, if it ends the war a minute sooner than it would have. I would like to address some specific concerns that have been raised against me.

The first one is about my divorce. I addressed this on my blog the other night. My divorce was in the works way before I came out to Crawford. My husband filed the papers before this all started. It just recorded last Friday. My husband didn't know that it would become public record, and public knowledge. He had told his lawyer not to serve me with the paperwork or even bother me while I was at Camp Casey. He was trying to do the right thing. He didn't want me to find out. Enough about that.

Another "big deal" today was the lie that I had said that Casey died for Israel. I never said that, I never wrote that. I had supposedly said it in a letter that I wrote to Ted Koppel's producer in March. I wrote the letter because I was upset at the way Ted treated me when I appeared at a Nightline Town Hall meeting in January right after the inauguration. I felt that Ted had totally disrespected me. I wrote the letter to Ted Bettag and cc'd a copy to the person who gave me Ted's address. I believe he (the person who gave me the address) changed the email and sent it out to capitalize on my new found notoriety by promoting his own agenda. Enough about that.

I didn't blog about the cross incident last night. I was at the Peace House when there was a big commotion and people started saying that someone had run over our Arlington Crawford display. I know this is old news because I have seen great posts about it today. This is how I feel. The right wingers are emailing me and spewing filth about me on the radio and on the television saying that I am dishonoring my son's memory. This man who ran over the crosses thinks he is a better American than we are. He thinks we are more patriotic than we are. Does he really believe that he is honoring the memories of the fallen and his country by running down 500 crosses and about 60 American flags? The Iraq Veterans Against the War who were here were also very offended. Those crosses represented their buddies who didn't make it home. And they are so aware of the fact that one of those crosses could have their name on it.

Yesterday, we had a counter protestor who played his guitar across the way from us and sang (very terribly!!!) a song that loosely went like this:

Aiding and abetting the enemy.
How many ghosts did you make today?
Google me this, Google me that,
How many ghosts did you make today?

I find it so ironic that he was singing it to me, and not to George Bush. We named the song: The Ballad of George Bush. He came back out today, but blessed be to God, he didn't bring his guitar, and he didn't sing.

We are moving to a place that doesn't have much shade and I put out an appeal for tarps and a soldier from Ft. Hood brought some to us that he "borrowed" from Ft. Hood for us to use. I have had a lot of soldiers from Ft. Hood come out and tell me to keep it up and that I am doing a good thing. We are doing this to honor Casey and the other fallen heroes in their memories. But we are doing it FOR the people of Iraq and the other soldiers who are in harm's way right now. Right after we heard about the crosses last night, a Camp Casey volunteer found out that a pen pal she had in Iraq was KIA on August 12th. This has to stop, now. We will stop it.
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Download and print
submitted by jaysea on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 10:02am PST
"Support The Truth" ribbons in yellow and blue

http://www.takeyourcountryback.com/BLOG/truth.htm

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THANKS Cindy!
submitted by janefordean on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 10:31am PST
Cindy, thank you from all of us out here who support our troops but oppose this war. I believe that thousands of people participated in vigils last night. Many, many people told us they were so glad to see an "anti-war" movement coming to life. You have given us hope! Please, take care of yourself and your family. Do not put yourself in danger, physically or emotionally. You have made an incredible sacrifice, we thank you for all you have given us. Bless you!
Jane
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Hello?
submitted by kt on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 9:05am PST
The difference is that Cherie Quarterolo (Casey's aunt)actually sent the family statement to KSFO, a radio station in San Francisco.
Besides, you want proof that my family is behind me? I can get it.
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More protest signs
submitted by Demetrius on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:40pm PST
Free to download and print

http://protest.bmgbiz.net/
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More Protest Signs...
submitted by helen abasket on Sat, 08/20/2005 - 11:11pm PST
Thanks for the link! You can bet a lot of us will be using it.
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Ignore the Critics
submitted by Sandy Madison on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:39pm PST
Cindy,
Focus, and stay with your simple message.

Do not get pulled into debates set to distract from your one very important message. Right at the time when you think everyone is getting tired of you repeating yourself is when people are just beginning to hear you. So, just repeat. There are many ears listening.

I hope you got the "Why We Worry" shirt. Alfred E. Bush. That glib man you want to talke to! I heard the postmaster was holding items without the last zip digits and am not sure I had them with the address provided me for Peace House. Send someone to the postoffice! :0)

www.cafepress.com/whitehousecrazy

Sandy
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Cindy is a Real American Hero!
submitted by Demetrius on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:25pm PST
Cindy, thank you for using your soap-box to bring attention to the questions that have gone far too long ignored.
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Stay focused - we are with you tonight.
submitted by IndySteve on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 9:50pm PST
Don't worry about the rabid right and what they say. Tonight, we are all behind you, thousands of us all over the country gathered together to light candles and show our support for you, the troops and peace. In northern Indiana, not exactly a liberal bastion, hundreds of people lined the street with candles and many more from all walks of life honked and cheered us as they drove by. It was invigorating. The tide is changing and you have helped do that. Stay strong and healthy. We are with you.
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Hi Cindy
submitted by gman on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 7:33pm PST
This kind of story never fails to make my blood boil. I realize that this woman has suffered a terrible, horrific loss... I most definitely realize that. I am a retired United States Marine who served his country for two decades in a number of ways and places, including Desert Storm... and my son is currently on active duty in the Marine Corps and just recently returned from duty in Iraq.

First and foremost, this woman is spitting on the memory of her own son. He was in the service because he wanted to be- and I can assure you that he was proud of being a military man and proud of his mission. His death only becomes meaningless when we back home choose to NOT honor his mission and his sacrifice. If it mattered to him, then it damn well should matter to all of us back here in Protected Land.

Lashing out in grief is an understandable response for anyone who goes through something as awful as losing a child. It is almost to be expected. This woman's son, though, was killed almost a year and a half ago. I think the initial shock should have worn off by now. She is saying some very, very moonbatty things now... consider the question she wants to personally ask the President: "Why did you kill my son? What did my son die for?"

Ma'am... you need to be straightened out on this. Right now. The President of the United States of America did NOT kill your son. Your son died at the hands of filthy islamo-fascist terrorists in a struggle for the very future of our world. The terrorists killed your son- who, by the way, will always be my brother in arms. I, for one, am very proud of him and his mission and his sacrifice. Furthermore, I know that it is the terrorist's fault that he is dead. Period.

Most people get this. The story also quotes a man supporting his country's actions- even though his son was also killed in the war.

[[ Boskovitch said his son, Jeff, "felt extremely, extremely strongly about the Iraqi people and our government deciding to go over there." "I firmly believe, and I would echo my son's feeling on this, it is very, very important for our country to remain steadfast and complete the mission that they set out to accomplish," Boskovitch told ABC on Sunday. ]]

As you can see, this man gets it. (Side note- any other source besides Fox News would most likely have not included this man's side of things... as is their usual practice, they would have applied the main focus only on the moonbat woman and her ranting- ignoring that the vast, overwhelming majority of families of deceased service members fully support their loved one's memory and mission.)

As long as we have people blaming America and our President for the evils that are attacking our world, we will not be able to defeat them. Victory begins with identifying the real enemy and then placing ALL of our national will and resources into the fight.
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Another easy one to deconstruct
submitted by coendou on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 8:06am PST
"Ma'am... you need to be straightened out on this. Right now. The President of the United States of America did NOT kill your son. Your son died at the hands of filthy islamo-fascist terrorists in a struggle for the very future of our world. The terrorists killed your son- who, by the way, will always be my brother in arms. I, for one, am very proud of him and his mission and his sacrifice. Furthermore, I know that it is the terrorist's fault that he is dead. Period."


Obviously spun or faulty resoning here.


One, Iraq under Saddam was a secular country. The Bathists started out as an egalitarian social system somewhere between western capitalism and eastern communism where people could practice non- extremist religions yet still be protected from egotistical corporatism. Of course it wasn't that in the end, but neither are we what we say we are, a country for and by the people. Extremists we not tolerated there though, be it Muslim or Christian.

The irony is that a good chunk of the people Saddam tortured, killed and imprisoned were islamo-fascists, and they are the ones that are free now and are trying to make an islamo-fascist country out of Iraq this very minute in the government. Not condoning torture and murder mind you even though the current admin in Iraq has begun it as well.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4672433.stm


If you were really concerned about islamo-fascism gman, then you would be on the other side of the fence, because Bush has escalated it not diminished it.

One country that is islamo-fascist is Saudi Arabia. Their Prince Bandar is so close to the Bushes that they call him Bandar Bush and has been to Crawford. Islamic law is enforced there with public beheadings weekly in Saudi Arabia, and women have less rights than dogs do here.

Two, as everyone has been saying, no U.S. troops would be over there without Bush. I'm sure there's a chance I could get killed going to Iran, or Pakistan just for being an American, that's why I don't go there. Of course there is blame for the perpetrator of the crime, but the real way to prevent the crime is to not be put in harms way.

As a veteran, knowing that being put in harm's way mistakenly or intentionally by your military leader is a great offense punishable by court-martial.

If your daughter's teacher sent her on a bus alone at age 16 to one of the most dangerous crime areas of one of our big cities with a 100 dollar bill in her hand, and she got mugged, kidnapped, raped or murdered, would you not blame the teacher for their neglegence, or would you merely blame the perpetrator?


Writings like this are either based on ignorance, mental instability or a conscious effort to distort the truth.
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Patriotic
submitted by mataliandy on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:31pm PST
If the cause is noble, then it must be possible for the President to tell us what that cause is. Since he has been unable to do so, but instead has supplied lie after lie, there's a pretty good chance that the war isn't so noble after all.

Sending people to die for an ignoble cause is not what this country is about. Raining bombs upon the innocent population of a country that posed no threat is not what this country is about - especially if it's being done instead of going after the bad guy who masterminded 9/11.

There are just and unjust wars. Accusing someone of being against our soldiers if they're against this unjust war, is like saying they're against firefighters if they don't support arson. This war does not meet a single one of the Just War criteria set out by St. Thomas Aquinas, nor does it meet the criteria taught at the Army War College.

It is patriotic to protest an unjust war that smears the good name of America. It is nationalistic to support a war just because your nation started it. There's a difference.
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Gman, You are no American
submitted by Jefferson on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:20pm PST
Gman, You say that Cindy is spitting on the memory of her own son. Would you say the same thing to a mother who demands to speak with the killer of her son? That is exactly what Cindy is doing right now.

Cindy's son enlisted to defend America and our Constitution, not to sacrifice his blood for the corporate profits of Bush's cronies. His reasons for enlisting were noble; the abuse of his sacrifice by the President is despictable. Nobody is blaming America; however, a majority of Americans are blaming Bush for causing the deaths of our soldiers and countlessly many innocent Iraqis for corporate greed.

You are obviously comfortable with a mission that is based on lies and deception, but the majority of Americans are not. If you attempted to inform yourself by retrieving information from varied media sources, you would have heard about recent poll numbers that state a majority of Americans disapprove of this war.

The true enemies of American freedom and democracy are vacationing in Crawford right now, while the true patriots and defenders of our freedom and democracy are at Camp Casey attempting to hold our treasonous leaders accountable for their conduct.
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Welcome to our world
submitted by IndySteve on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:07pm PST
Well, Gman, you have your view, and that is all it is -- your point of view. It isn't THE TRUTH. Millions of us believe we honor the troops by working hard to end this quagmire. And the majority of the American people are with us that this is a big mistake. Our President and his advisors LIED to us...about the uranium, about Saddam's capability, about WMD's, about how it would be a "cakewalk", and more. We get it.
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Thank you
submitted by kt on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 8:20pm PST
Thank you, gman. I enjoyed reading your comment.
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Can YOU...
submitted by kt on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 6:15pm PST
Umm, Can YOU read at all? Because if you are reading my comments, you would notice that I go over the several issues that do not mention Cindy Sheehan AT ALL, but instead focus on Bush, noble causes, and other subjects.
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ROADSIDE SIGN POSTS
submitted by federico on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 11:49am PST
Get several signs with a simple, values-based message such as "DIGNITY and RESPECT," or "HUMANITY, DIGNITY and RESPECT," or "HUMANIZE GEORGE BUSH."

Also, I love the phrase in the Sacr. for Democracy site: "HONOR OUR DEAD (or better yet, HONOR OUR GRIEF, or HONOR OUR LOSSES, (or Honor the fallen), DEMAND THE TRUTH."

Another sign could say:

**IRAQ WAR CASUALTIES**

U.S. military:
1,850 DEAD
14,000 WOUNDED

Allied forces:
194 DEAD

Reconstruction civilians:
255 DEAD

Iraqi civilians:
25,000 DEAD

SOURCE: The Washington Post


Another sign could say:
WHERE ARE THE WMDs?
LINK TO AL-QAEDA?
IRAQI DEMOCRACY?
BRING BACK THE TROOPS

Another sign could say:

George: Stop piling on debt on our children's backs!
Less than 2 months until our national debt reaches $8 Trillion
SOURCE: U.S. NATIONAL DEBT www.brillig.com/debt_clock

(YOU'VE DONE ENOUCH HARM WITH THIS UNNESCESSARY WAR)

Fede
Arlington, Va.
latinosblog.com
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Does it matter whether Cindy's family agrees with her?
submitted by Ginny on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 9:06am PST
Does it make Cindy's plight less honorable or less patriotic?

It's rare to find any family in America that agrees on whether this war is right or not.

I'll stand with Cindy, along with millions of other Americans, regardless of whether her family agrees with her, because Cindy is putting herself on the line for all of us by speaking out against this corrupt administration.
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How did you know?
submitted by kt on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 8:47am PST
Yes, I did. You are very insightful.
I have yet to see a message of support from quote:all of Cindy's children, her sister and her parents with all of their names included.

Since you seem to like Drudge so much, what about this one from Casey's aunt and godmother (if she was chosen as Casey's godmother, it is unlikely that she and Cindy were/are enemies, so there goes the in-law arguement):

Our family has been so distressed by the recent activities of Cindy we are breaking our silence and we have collectively written a statement for release. Feel free to distribute it as you wish.

Thanks, Cherie

FYI:The above mentioned statement is the one I posted before.
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Can you ...
submitted by Tjadendevries on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 3:48pm PST
...debate on ideas? Rather than ad hominem attacks. Or isn't there any substance to your attacks?
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Your family
submitted by kt on Tue, 08/16/2005 - 10:09pm PST
Since you are "putting out fires", I thought you might answer this: Why does your family not agree with you? I have posted this before but in a family statement they said:


The Sheehan Family lost our beloved Casey in the Iraq War and we have been silently, respectfully grieving. We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of Cindy Sheehan. She now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the the expense of her son's good name and reputation. The rest of the Sheehan Family supports the troops, our country, and our President, silently, with prayer and respect.

Sincerely,

Casey Sheehan's grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins.


I find it interesting that all of them would disagree with you, and that (as far as I know) no family members openly support you.
Could you shed any light on this topic?
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heh... We can make $#!+ up, too...
submitted by Demetrius on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 10:31pm PST
Why does your family not agree with *you?* In a family statement they said:

We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of kt. He/She now appears to be promoting his/her own personal agenda and notoriety at the the expense of his/her country's good name and reputation. The rest of kt's family supports the troops, and our country, and wants the truth for them all.

Sincerely,

kt's grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins,
and Epstein's mother.
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Thanks Demetrius
submitted by billl on Wed, 08/17/2005 - 11:11pm PST
I saw that letter on the Drudge Report too. It is sad to see that kt's family is against him/her. Apparently, if anyone in your family disagrees with you, then you must shut up.

Sorry kt, you should mend things with your family before proceeding.
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Forgot to mention these ;)
submitted by kt on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 9:17am PST
I forgot to mention that I have no inlaws and it would probably be against the law for me to have them, me being a minor and all. So there is no chance of my husband divorcing me either.
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You must be seeing things
submitted by kt on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 9:12am PST
I think it shows a true Democrat when you do not answer back on the issues such as responding to my comment Oh Really? but instead engage in comments such as this. It sounds like your reasoning is "kt (or Drudge) must have lied, because if she/they didn't, it would upset my whole belief system, so she/they must have lied, and therefore I can lie too."
What is it? Are you scared of arguing with a 15-year-old?
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Back to the reason you are here in the first place
submitted by billl on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 10:08am PST
What noble cause did Casey die for? And why can't your pResident tell Cindy what this noble cause is?

There must be a reason why we are killing thousands of Americans and tens of thousands of Iraqi's. According to Bush, it is noble to kill innocent humans.

Bush and all that support this immoral war/occupation will pay the ultimate price when they have to meet their maker. Luckily, you are so young that you should be able to live long enough to see the truth when it is finally exposed. There were millions of naive Americans that believed our corrupt government as to why we were in Vietnam. Man, were they wrong.

However, if you continue to support the imperial policies of the Bush cabal, then you will be drafted when you are 18 and you can put your money where your mouth is. Please educate yourself and read the Project for a New American Century (PNAC) You will find that many of the Bush cabal have signed this document. It will show you how their goal is to permanently occupy the Middle East (and the rest of the world).

I'm not sure if you know about tax dollars yet (do they still teach business or civics classes in high school?) but why don't you look into how much Bush has spent SO FAR in the war/struggle in Iraq. You should be able to figure out that YOU are going to pay for this in future tax dollars. Money does not grow on trees (I'm sure they taught you that already) so the cost of this war/struggle will be passed on to you. So will the cost of all the additional wars that PNAC plans to have.

If you are a real Regressive Radical Right'r, then you should have already invested your savings (or encouraged your family to invest their savings) in the industrial military complex (e.g Halliburton). It would be a wise investment if you truly believe that American Imperialism will succeed. But if you actually believe that American Imperialism is good for us, please open your history book and look at what happened to all the other empires that this world has ever seen.
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Deja Vu?
submitted by kt on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 8:57pm PST
I think I have seen these somewhere before. Let's go through them, shall we? (See the old comments here)
  1. In your comment "Back to the reason..." you say: What noble cause did Casey die for? And why can't your pResident tell Cindy what this noble cause is?

    In your comment "The focus..." you also say: Bush needs to answer the question.What "noble cause" did Casey die for? Bush is the one who made the empty "noble cause" statement. That's all Cindy is asking.It's really quite simple.

    My reply to "the focus" in "Noble Cause": I'll answer for him then, since I guess you don't know. By going into Iraq, we have stopped a dictator from killing over what is estimated to be 300,000 of his own people. See the article here To me, an innocent life is an innocent life, whether it is Iraqi or American, and the less innocent lives lost the better. That is the noble cause. It really is quite simple.

  2. You in "Back to the reason": Please educate yourself and read the Project for a New American Century (PNAC) You will find that many of the Bush cabal have signed this document. It will show you how their goal is to permanently occupy the Middle East (and the rest of the world).

    You in "team effort":I suggest you educate yourself and read the Project for a New American Century if you want to know why your pResident lied us into this war. They have been working on this war/occupation for years. http://www.newamericancentury.org/According to their own document, Rebuilding America’s Defenses ( .pdf format ) their stated goals would never be realized “absent some catastrophic catalyzing event –like a new Pearl Harbor”. (page 52). The Sept. 11th attacks fit nicely into their plan. Kind of makes you wonder...

    My reply in "Oh Really":I did as you suggested and educated myself, and although I learned a lot about missile defense systems, I was unable to find the quote that you used. Perhaps you could educate me again?

I am beginning to think you get this stuff out of a liberal database for when conservatives have you lost and confused or something, just judging from the number of times the stuff is used.

Now, new subjects:

quote: However, if you continue to support the imperial policies of the Bush cabal, then you will be drafted when you are 18 and you can put your money where your mouth is.

Let me assure you that when I am 18 and drafted I will apologize for being so right all the time and grovel at your feet.

Quote: I'm not sure if you know about tax dollars yet (do they still teach business or civics classes in high school?) but why don't you look into how much Bush has spent SO FAR in the war/struggle in Iraq. You should be able to figure out that YOU are going to pay for this in future tax dollars. Money does not grow on trees (I'm sure they taught you that already) so the cost of this war/struggle will be passed on to you. So will the cost of all the additional wars that PNAC plans to have.

Your (I am only guessing that the website is yours, tell me if I am wrong) website says that the cost of war in Iraq is $188,411,944,000 (or something close to that) I would gladly pay the taxes and any else that I can(/could). How about educating yourself on the way the government uses its taxes? As you can see on page 38 of the list of charts, the total cost for 2004 for "Defense—Military" is 437.1 billion, while "Health and Human Services" is 543.4 billion and "Social Security Administration" is 530.2. Just because something is expensive does not mean that it is not worth it.

Quote: If you are a real Regressive Radical Right'r, then you should have already invested your savings (or encouraged your family to invest their savings) in the industrial military complex (e.g Halliburton). It would be a wise investment if you truly believe that American Imperialism will succeed. But if you actually believe that American Imperialism is good for us, please open your history book and look at what happened to all the other empires that this world has ever seen.

Sorry, my family has an organic farm and no investments in Halliburton. And just how would it be a wise investment? And where is the empire? Since we have "conquered and invaded" Japan and Germany in former wars, why aren't they part of the US and our "empire"? And what would stop Iraq from becoming as independent as they are?

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So many new visitors!
submitted by Amy Price on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 1:55pm PST
I am so excited to see all these new "faces" on our website--both those with names I recognize from BFA, dailykos, etc. :) and those who are willingly bringing themselves to the educational possibilities of our website :)2x. Think I'd be so warmly welcomed on Free Republic? Nah, I won't chance it.

I have to say, tho, I am jonesing for a troll goal! Anyone who knows how to set this up? (Not you, Bill; I know what all is on your plate for the next week.) You know what I mean: every time you respond to a troll, or even just think about it but choose not to, you chip in a donation to, say, Gold Star Families for Peace, or even, dare I suggest it, Sacramento for Democracy. Like a curse-word kitty! You get to have your say with the trolls and support our treasured organizations. If setting up online contributions is beyond us for now, I'd say I trust the good people of Sacramento for Democracy and all our democracy-loving friends to contribute on the honor system. Any takers?
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Warmly Welcomed?
submitted by kt on Thu, 08/18/2005 - 9:07pm PST
Quote: Think I'd be so warmly welcomed on Free Republic? Nah, I won't chance it

And I have been warmly welcomed? ("There is plenty of room for your Anti-American hate-filled comments if you so desire (or not).", etc.)

Anyway, I have an idea. How about you donate more when you make a comment that actually makes sense?
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Forgive me
submitted by Amy Price on Fri, 08/19/2005 - 10:53am PST
You know, I was really referring to my own comment that I am happy to see opposing viewpoints, such as some of those posted by you, here. It makes all of us sharper when we have to make our arguments to those who disagree with us. But as I re-read what I wrote, I can see that it was incongruous of me then to talk about trolls. Although that is a commonly used word in the blogosphere, it is nonetheless unflattering and it was unkind of me to use it. So, kt, I am asking your forgiveness for implying that you are a troll. You are a person and I need to honor that, even when we disagree--maybe especially when we disagree.

That said, I am growing tired of your criticisms of Cindy, whom I know and whom I am guessing you do not, as she is just a parent, like many of us here, and her son honored his duty to his buddies (his word) and went to Iraq based on a deliberately constructed set of lies by your president and his friends in PNAC/Halliburton/big oil. Casey lost his life because the Bush cabal attacked Iraq to increase their own personal power and wealth. Not because of terrorism, 9/11, democracy, brutal dictatorship, WMD's, or anything else. Cindy is doing what I would do in her shoes, if I had her courage, stability, and perseverance. The drive to protect your children is very strong, and Cindy, having lost her Casey, is only trying to protect the children of the rest of us now. It was easy for me as a teen to criticize what I saw as parental overprotection, until I experienced the "mama bear" reflex myself. So I guess what I'm asking of you is this: instead of attacking Cindy, if you want us to listen to your views on this war and this administration, make an affirmative case for them. Because Cindy's trying to save your life, too.
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Reply to "Forgive Me" and "Instead of talking..."
submitted by kt on Sat, 08/20/2005 - 9:00pm PST
Quote: It makes all of us sharper when we have to make our arguments to those who disagree with us.

I agree.

Quote: The drive to protect your children is very strong, and Cindy, having lost her Casey, is only trying to protect the children of the rest of us now.

The only problem is that these are adults, not children. They can make their own decisions, and they decided that going into the military was something they wanted to do.

Where is this oil that you talk about? Where exactly are they getting it from and where exactly is it going?

Quote:So I guess what I'm asking of you is this: instead of attacking Cindy, if you want us to listen to your views on this war and this administration, make an affirmative case for them.

Quote:why don't you post a blog of similar length of four reasons you personally feel compelled to volunteer to serve in the U. S. military in this war in Iraq?

All that Cindy (and you and Bill and almost everyone here) is doing is criticising (attacking) Bush. I think that if you think I should write something "affirmative", you should also write something "affirmative". How about writing about how you think the situation in Iraq (an estimated 300,000 people dying because they just didn't agree with their government) should have been taken care of (or why we should have let them die, if that is your belief), and how you PERSONALLY would do it (maybe volunteer to be a weapons inspector or something, I don't know). And, you should have 4 reasons why someone should volunteer to do it.
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Happy to do it.
submitted by Amy Price on Mon, 08/22/2005 - 9:25am PST
After you, since I invited you first.
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Why You Should Enlist
submitted by kt on Tue, 08/23/2005 - 5:18pm PST
Fine. Not sure exactly what you wanted but here it is:
(If anything is inaccurate, I apologize. Since I have never been to Iraq, I can only work with the information I have.)

My reasons why you should enlist:

You would be helping a new democracy develop. Because of the troops already in Iraq, Iraq’s former dictator, Saddam Hussein, has been captured, and his reign has ended. Iraqis have voted (including women) of their own free will. Also from truthorfiction.com:
1. According to a UNICEF report at the end of 2003, more than 3 1/2 million children had been immunized.
2. Again, according to an April, 2004 report from UNICEF, school attendance in Iraq increased by 60 percent shortly after the war to more than 95 percent during the recent national exam week.
3. UNICEF says that as of April, 2004, more than 2,500 schools have been renovated with the goal of 4,000 being completed by the end of the year, but 10,000 more need repair.
4. In a November, 2003 interview on National Public Radio, Andrew Natsios of the U.S. Agency for International Development said that the port at Umm Qasar, Iraq's largest, is modern and functioning for the first time in 20 years.
5. Because of disrepair and looting, it took a lot of work to get hospitals back up to speed but according to James Haverman, the Coalition Provisional Authority Senior Advisor to the Iraqi Ministry of Health, all 240 hospitals in Iraq as well as 2400 primary health care clinics were operating as of December, 2003.
6. Work is underway to restore healthy water and sewage treatment to more than 14-million Iraqis.
7. On March 8, 2004, an interim constitution that defines Iraq as being "federal, democratic and pluralist" was signed by members of the Iraqi Governing Council.

One reason why you should not volunteer:
1. Being in the military at this time means that it is most likely that you will be in combat sometime in your military career. You may possibly die. If you suspect that if this happens your mother will go crazy and start blaming everyone (except the person that killed you) for your death, DO NOT enlist. I repeat, DO NOT enlist.

YOUR TURN!
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What are the names of these "relatives"?
submitted by billl on Tue, 08/16/2005 - 11:25pm PST
You didn't happen to get this from Drudge did you?

It's funny that it was "signed" without any names. You would think they would be proud to list their names.

Those generic relatives wouldn't happen to be in-laws would they? Because, you know, no one ever says anything bad about their in-laws.

For the record, all of Cindy's children, her sister and her parents are supportive of her. Blood relative support means so much more than in-law support.
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